How do you look to Muslims ?

[_THE_SPY_]

First of all, Al Salam Alaikum...
Second thing, there is no second thing just lets hop on

That's a double edged sword buddy, eastern media portrays the west as sinners (kafirs) and their women who have the freedom to dress how they like, as whores.
I don't agree with either, but this east vs west propaganda goes deeper than just the opinion of the medias.

Well let me tell you a small story about very small thing called the "freedom" for you

We (Arab) see our womens, which wear naked and short clothes a .... but not yours, Why ?
Because here in the east the life is different 180 Degree than the west
in many things, and one of these things The Wear, here in the east people (Muslims and non-Muslims as well even before the Islam) used to cover the women, well ?
That was kinda a an old past, now lets say 100 years ago the women (Here in the east) knew something from the west called the freedom of the women, well done, everybody is free, and have the freedom to choose their clothes and everything, well there is nothing bad.
Wait a year, 2,4,6 or even 10, you find the number of the womens who are reporting for provocation from the mens in the streets getting increased, and getill increased even for now while typing the number is getting increased...

- Who we should blame ?
= The men
- ?
= yh the men, those weak creatures who cant control their nature when they see a hot women with very short clothes with someparts are transparent
and showing half her boobs, only that yh only that, oh sorry forgot to mention her perfect body!, which i can see all the details of it, because of these clothes like she is wearing no thing!
- What we will do then ?
= keep insulting the men, and making ORGs to make them think in better ways and dont repeat this dirty acts again
- But we just could make a limit for the shortness of clothes for the women to stop this!
= are you stupid ?! and the freedom of the women?, no no no its bad suggestion lets keep blaming the men better
- ok ok ok, next time i will control my nature which i was borned with it when i see a women with good clothes covering her body not naked one
= yh that is good, now let me alone my girlfriend is comi... i meant my family my family!
~The end
And thats why we call most of the womens who do that with this word as you said, but still not yours we call our womens who do that, you know why ?
As a real Muslim, you cannot ever insult a group of people, because their traditions
As you have yours, they have their own one, and you should show respect to everybody, even who dont respect you, you should respect them

But in same time we call our womens which do that with this word, Because they should not do it, and its a rule, and everybody break a rule is a bad boi

And i would like to tell you 2 things else
1 )
sinner or kafir, have to means in the Arabic (As far as i know)
kafir : Who is not on you religion
this one is peaceful, with this man you can even share you house with him
Kafir : Who is not on you religion, But attacking you or preparing armies to attack you country
this one, should be careful with him, because you dont know what is going to do
2)
We Arab make our women get covered, because the honor of the women is very expensive thing, and cannot be bought by the money, so we actually make our women as the ruby hard to reach it, but in the west, you know.. most of you have full relation with girls (And most of those girls have had a full relation before this one ) before the marriage and this cases to do many operations in the hospital you know that operation which kills the kid inside his mother (With an metal thing keep pulling a parts from the child body, the hands, the legs, the head....) i dont know how the doctors get the power to do that, they dont have heart ?, and his parents ?, dont they have heart ?, dont they have feelings ?, least thing to call them is a monsters, in human skin (i mean his parents, Because the doctor is just forced to do his job to feed his family)
For only 1 or 1.5 Hour of the fun, they kill a kid
If the freedom will cause to kill thousands of kids daily, then who want it ?, you ?, i dont think because you might been that kid, one day...

They found a passport at the plane wreckage. Not only that but they CONFIRMED who boarded the hijacked plane (you gotta give your passport before you go on a plane, no?), also there's radio call evidence of the flight attendants who identified some of the hijackers.
And the biggest evidence of all is high ranking Al-Qaeda members themselves taking responsibility for the attack.
So let's leave these fun conspiracy theories aside.

Well, you are right Arab did it, lets go deeper...
I want you to do the following thing
imagine a stick, normal stick but it is standing like (|), nothing is speacil, now hit this stick with anything, what will happen ? it will fall, how ?
by getting different orientation, right ?
This mean it will be like (/ or \) then (-) and destroy many buildings with it , good ?
The tow towers didnt do that, no but fallen down a floor on a floor on a floor... (I got this from man TV channels, i am still not sure if that was real or just imagination how show what happened)
This is the first thing
Get the second thing
The CEO or the manger (i dont know how to call it in English), and most of the important people working there, in that day they didnt come, to the tower, lol ?
For example, lets say everyday, every normal day the tower have about 10K~15k person, but today 1K~3k
Its like everyday the towers are full of important people, mangers, CEOs, ETC...
But today all of them have a party, thats why they didnt come
I am not saying like trump or the white house did it or smh, i am just wondering, and telling how it look from my side, with the information i got

It is uncommon, but not impossible. Take a look at the holy books before Quran like the Bible and Torah. And even Greek philosophy who had no microscopes but speculated about atoms in 450B.C. That's 1000 years before the revelations of prophet Muhammad. There were geniuses back then just like there are geniuses now.

i will answer this back in the last

That's one way of interpreting it. Or it could just mean crush as in literally getting stepped on and crushed (cause you know, ants are small and when you step on them they get crushed, like we get crushed if we get stepped on by an elephant or something falls on us). But i see how you would interlink these two things.

Well you are right, good point, since everybody own a brain, and can interlink anything as they like, But when they want me to believe something, then they have to give me a logical reason
And when they give me explained logical theory, they put me between 3 choices
1) Believe it
Or
2) Get my own logical one, and put them between the same 3 choices
3) Escape it, and start to trash talk
And i gave you but its not my logical one (i cannot explain a part of the Quran or any Holy book unless i see scientist/Shiekh explained it before, and i understand it from him), but scientists' one
i believe yours, but yours is still logical theory, and still not fact as the one i gave, right ?
But lets get the logically one by using our brains
i choose the one i gave you, do you know why ?
you are saying he (Allah) might not mean that, but i tell you if he didnt meant that, then its useless to mention it, of course there is a reason to mention that, and they gave you that reason, now you have to choice,
Believe or Try hard and get better logical theory or Escape and start trash talking
Your brain, your choice

this surah simply talks about obedience and choosing your path in life , it has little to do with insects or what lives within them.This is hardly a miracle. You could have chosen a better example, like the Quran states that salt water and fresh water don't fully mix. It was only later observed by scientists that this is indeed a fact.You know what i mean?
You can pick and choose what you want from any book and label them as miracles, and there will be countless debates on it.It doesn't prove or disprove anything.

I am sorry i typed it wrong
I typed it >

2) The Mosquito In The Holy Quran

Allah, said in the Holy Quran, that he is not ashamed to show you a miracle in the mosquito or what even smaller than it!

i should have written it like this >

2) The Mosquito In The Holy Quran

Allah, said in the Holy Quran, that he is not ashamed to show you a miracle in the mosquito or what above it it!

i apologize, i typed it wrong
Here is the surah

Spoiler: show

Surely Allah is not ashamed to set forth any parable-- (that of) a gnat or any thing above that; then as for those who believe, they know that it is the truth from their Lord, and as for those who disbelieve, they say: What is it that Allah means by this parable: He causes many to err by it and many He leads aright by it! but He does not cause to err by it (any) except the transgressors,

I am sorry again, it was my fault i didnt re-read what i type
Well, Allah said in the Holy Quran what you have just read in the surah, which means, The Quran mentioned a small thing above the mosquito, you say its hardly to be miracle i tell you no, its easy to count it as a miracle, since it only can be seen by electron microscope, and the electron microscope is new invention, in our ages, not 1400 years ago
And i explained everything there
And i am sorry again for that mistake hope i wont repeat it, my apologize

NASA wasn't but the Bible surely was. You can read the Genesis yourself , it talks about the same thing, how God created the heavens and the earth and stretched (expanded) them and then separated them etc.
While you can claim this as a Quran miracle , other's can debate that it's plagiarized from another holy book,centuries before the Quran.

Well another good point too...
Get me that book, which said that but it should be older the Holy Quran
And you have to know that, as i told karu, Allah sent over more than 2K messenger to specific people (His Tribe), And expect that Allah sent them with Holy Books, or how you think people will believe and not call them lairs ?
And as well, we all the these Holy Books which were sent, with those messengers, peace upon all of them
With its own miracles, and i say that you might be right and might me wrong, that the Quran got this info from another Holy Book
But add an thing for you, we as Muslims, believe that the Quran, telling you what happened for the disbelievers before us, and how was their end, and came with these miracles to make you believe, that it have a message from Allah, telling you to abide his rules which in the Quran and Holy Books before it!

And nobody can say there is no god but nobody can prove that
If you say there is no god, then prove that, with logical reason, i am here 15 years old guy, telling anybody believes that there is no god, then i am here and prove it for me

Yet in some countries if they choose to wear a skirt they get stoned...and not the good kind of stoning if you know what i mean
how is that not disrespectful?

As i say, For us as Arab, the honor of the women is expensive thing, But i said that was an old past doing this was kinda normal thing, nobody want to see all the men in the streets looking to his daughter, its normal to look, but not to look with looks saying "Look this .... walking the street and unashamed of that wear"
So those people, still doing these rare traditions, and its normal thing for them (its the not the first time to hear about those people but i barely hear about them)
As for Islam we see this is the right thing to do, but not the right way
how is that not disrespectful?
Now after reading the first about the freedom, tell me do you see it disrespectful now?
Plus, Islam have a rule for everything, i serious when i mean for everything even killing an ant have a rule
Put must of the Muslims now days dont follow these rules, its barley to ask a guy now with +20 years, and find his knowledge is big about the religion related things, because everybody want to play PUBG and dont have some time to prepare for the place where he will live his infinity life there

You are referring to a TV show that is made for shock value and sensationalism, for moral standards? This has nothing to do with ordinary/common women.
I like how you voice your opinion on morals when it comes to female promiscuity but keep silent when men are allowed multiple wives, or even worse, multiple sex slaves in conquered regions. So before you point a finger to the western moral standards, remember that 3 fingers are pointed back at you.
And if you ask me, i don't agree with either of the extremes. There's a reason why STDs exist.

Well, you said we are allowed to have 4 wives, and that is true, and as far as i know that the Islam is the only religion which allows the man to marry 4 (more than 1 generally)

But did you get deeper in that ?, do you think to marry 4 its an easy thing ?,and its not only about the sexual natural, but
Allah gave you a list of rules, you should abide when you are about to marry more than 1
And if you didnt follow it, you wife can jail, Divorce, get her right of the money, sons, and the house, know why ?, because Allah said if you will marry more than 1, then you have to be fear between them, how ?
lets say you are married and have 4 wives
and sadly one of your wives, became sick, you have to buy medicine for her
If you will buy for her, then you will buy the same medicine for the other 3
If you bought a car for one, then you will get a 3 cars for the other 3
If you spent a pound on one of your sons, then you will spend a 1 pound for each son, of your sons from the same and the other wives as well
And Islam with this thing is serious about this thing, you cant take it easy, and you know what ?
Having many wives, isnt the problem here, the problem if you wives had a problem between them together, then you will be in a .... situation, lol you dont know whos right here, and you
are not a god to know whos right and whos lying, So please before speaking about something 90% of the Muslims dont do it anyway, go and search the rules of it, its a lot of rules and serious
And calling it with "Multiple sex slaves in conquered regions", you can only have sex with one wife, in the same time, not 2 or 3 or 4
And you speak about a kinda rare situation, but i am speaking about generally how is the situation in the west, there is a very big difference
And please dont speak about the moral standards, because morals for you is 180 Degree difference for us (And we all know that).

As an ex-muslim i have gained very little perspective from this. I've had these debates with muslim friends years ago and it's always the same argument of nit-picking verses from the holy book and interpreting them to your own liking.
To me it doesn't matter where you come from or what religion you choose to practice,we're all human beings struggling to get by.

About the question i said i will answer it in the last
Look bro, while i am reading i felt sad because you were Muslim and left the Islam...
But in same time, i knew that you were "Muslim" by the name only, and not real Muslim

Spoiler: show

Quran It is uncommon, but not impossible. Take a look at the holy books before Quran like the Bible and Torah. And even Greek philosophy who had no microscopes but speculated about atoms in 450B.C. That's 1000 years before the revelations of prophet Muhammad. There were geniuses back then just like there are geniuses now.

The real Muslim Believes that El Zapor, El Torah, El Engel and El Quran, and many other Holy Books are from the same god who's Allah
And have the same message, saying "Abide Allah's rules"
And as i said The Real Muslim believes in all these Holy Books, and its a rule in the Islam to believe in them to be a real Muslim!
=================
Hope i Explained everything for you, and i am typing in this since 4:00 A.M
And i appreciate the time it took you to type all this, and thanks for you participation in this topic
And i would like to mention you Adien i didnt get anything from google and Allah witness that, so please next time keep watching and learn
Salam Alaikum!

[Panadol]

What are you saying?!

Kafir : Who is not on you religion, But attacking you or preparing armies to attack you country
this one, should be careful with him, because you dont know what is going to do

Please before saying anything know what are you saying, kafir means the one who just does not believe in allah or says allah has children and a wife or whatever it has been said in The Holy Qura'an, please check about everything I don't have time to check all of what you said but some of it are just wrong thoughts or meanings, if you want to talk about religion (which is a sensitive topic) then DON'T MAKE MISTAKES about it.
What I meant is.. Who says allah is not a god a kafir and who says allah has a son and a wife or whatever (allah are 3) this is a kafir like who does not believe in allah that he is a god and who says there are other gods than allah.
I hope everything explained well now.

[_THE_SPY_]

What are you saying?!
Please before saying anything know what are you saying, kafir means the one who just does not believe in allah or says allah has children and a wife or whatever it has been said in The Holy Qura'an, please check about everything I don't have time to check all of what you said but some of it are just wrong thoughts or meanings, if you want to talk about religion (which is a sensitive topic) then DON'T MAKE MISTAKES about it.
What I meant is.. Who says allah is not a god a kafir and who says allah has a son and a wife or whatever (allah are 3) this is a kafir like who does not believe in allah that he is a god and who says there are other gods than allah.
I hope everything explained well now.

Please before accusing me with this go learn the Arabic which is your language
I said it have 2 means (as far as i know), and if you only know 1, or you have read only 1 mean then it's your own problem
We can also speak on discord if you want
Mr.Spy.#7777

[_THE_SPY_]

Hi...
If it is possible to just take 7 minutes of your age, please watch this
Take a look in the channel, if you dont mind

You know guys, i feel sometimes i wasted my time creating this topic and sometimes no
Because as it have cons it have positives too!
The cons, I didnt find, at least for me
The positives, i got new information about somethings wrong, and i always thought right
And knew some people on their real face, Some want to have a good speech, some asslick and some trash talk in a such topic, and i think i am not alone who knew them... whatever

My last advice here in this topic, You are in a exam, many choices but only 2 results success or fail, every exam have timer, sadly you dont know the timer and cant control it as well
The answers for this small exam are easy to find, But...

=====
Also i wanted to mention you Gangsta19, to apologize..

Spoiler: show

They found a passport at the plane wreckage. Not only that but they CONFIRMED who boarded the hijacked plane (you gotta give your passport before you go on a plane, no?), also there's radio call evidence of the flight attendants who identified some of the hijackers.
And the biggest evidence of all is high ranking Al-Qaeda members themselves taking responsibility for the attack.
So let's leave these fun conspiracy theories aside.

After searching some channels via google, i found that some channels says "Osama bin laden"
who did it, and he was Muslim, but the thing prevents me from believing that, is that some channels as well saying Osama didnt die in that day but got killed (i am still not sure about this)
So for now since i am not sure about it, lets say a he did it
But still nobody can say all the the Muslims are terrorists because very low number of them have such hate or smh
Also i guess you are christian now right ?, just guessing

Peace

[_THE_SPY_]

Admins, Please lock this topic.

My discord still open
Mr.Spy.#7777

[Boone]

The biggest problem in the Muslim world/Muslim mindset is that they believe whatever written in the Quran is unfalsifiable. If you begin your belief by already pre-conditioning your mind like this, you will never get anywhere.

Let me just drop this simple "sahih hadith":

Spoiler: show

Reported ‘Aisha (RA): The verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times was revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept under my pillow. When the Messenger of Allah (pbuh) expired and we were occupied by his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper. (Sunan Ibn Majah, Hadith 1944)

‘Abdullah b. ‘Abbas reported that ‘Umar b. Khattab sat on the pulpit of Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) and said: Verily Allah sent Muhammad (may peace be upon him) with truth and He sent down the Book upon him, and the verse of stoning was included in what was sent down to him. We recited it, retained it in our memory and understood it. Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) awarded the punishment of stoning to death (to the married adulterer and adulteress) and, after him, we also awarded the punishment of stoning, I am afraid that with the lapse of time, the people (may forget it) and may say: We do not find the punishment of stoning in the Book of Allah, and thus go astray by abandoning this duty prescribed by Allah. Stoning is a duty laid down in Allah’s Book for married men and women who commit adultery when proof is established, or it there is pregnancy, or a confession. (Saheeh Muslim Book 017, Number 4194:

A goat had eaten part of the Quran, mentioned in Sahih Hadith. So here if you don't believe this hadith, it means all Sahih Hadith is subject to being a lie. So you are left with Quran, which also is incomplete narrative in it of itself. Most of Islamic teachings are out of the Hadith, which seems to be falsified now. Islam would be left with doubt

There's much more, but I'll leave you with this to start your journey with research on Islam.

[Boone]

God in it of itself is a falsifiable equation. An Omniscient God would not create anything. It would simply exist. This can be proven with mathematics.

[Snipaxxyy]

The biggest problem in the Muslim world/Muslim mindset is that they believe whatever written in the Quran is unfalsifiable. If you begin your belief by already pre-conditioning your mind like this, you will never get anywhere.

Let me just drop this simple "sahih hadith":

Spoiler: show

Reported ‘Aisha (RA): The verse of stoning and of suckling an adult ten times was revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept under my pillow. When the Messenger of Allah (pbuh) expired and we were occupied by his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper. (Sunan Ibn Majah, Hadith 1944)

‘Abdullah b. ‘Abbas reported that ‘Umar b. Khattab sat on the pulpit of Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) and said: Verily Allah sent Muhammad (may peace be upon him) with truth and He sent down the Book upon him, and the verse of stoning was included in what was sent down to him. We recited it, retained it in our memory and understood it. Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) awarded the punishment of stoning to death (to the married adulterer and adulteress) and, after him, we also awarded the punishment of stoning, I am afraid that with the lapse of time, the people (may forget it) and may say: We do not find the punishment of stoning in the Book of Allah, and thus go astray by abandoning this duty prescribed by Allah. Stoning is a duty laid down in Allah’s Book for married men and women who commit adultery when proof is established, or it there is pregnancy, or a confession. (Saheeh Muslim Book 017, Number 4194:

A goat had eaten part of the Quran, mentioned in Sahih Hadith. So here if you don't believe this hadith, it means all Sahih Hadith is subject to being a lie. So you are left with Quran, which also is incomplete narrative in it of itself. Most of Islamic teachings are out of the Hadith, which seems to be falsified now. Islam would be left with doubt

There's much more, but I'll leave you with this to start your journey with research on Islam.

Sounds like you're the one who needs to do some research, as you're just blindly trying to put a religion down to convince yourself that your theory of God being nonexistent is true.

Hadith is nothing definitive that you could potentially call out of being false. There isn't a book that is entirely perfect except Quran.

Spoiler: show

Quran being "incomplete", sounds about right to me. Many sentences in Quran remained senseless until science proved or what was said actually happened. Let me remind you that there are things written in the Quran that were discovered hundreds of years later, and just to note, Quran does not change every now and then as other religious books do.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quran_and_miracles

[Immortal]

Locked upon request by the topic creator