Re- Allow to shock cop while Cuffed [DENIED]

[Robin]

criminals are now able to shock whilst cuffed, developers rolling out secret updates
edit: this is not supposed to happen, and is most probably a bug since no one implemented this

The only secret updates are admin-related updates.

You're not supposed be be able to shock if you're cuffed by Cops or Army. If cuffed by Swat, you should still be able to shock.
Please open a bug report if you have more information.

[Mastro]

criminals are now able to shock whilst cuffed, developers rolling out secret updates
edit: this is not supposed to happen, and is most probably a bug since no one implemented this

This is a bug, true, and it will be fixed very soon. Chances are the cop changes will remain as they are.

To the ones who claim how cops are really powerful now, I would like to remind you how things used to be back in 2015. Keep in mind there were very few complaints about 'balance', and criminal activity was way higher than now (in case one claims now it's low because of the recent updates):

- Cuff range was way longer (now you have to be fairly close)
- There was no Blackmarket
- No taze reflector
- No ability to move whilst cuffed
- Unlimited cuffs for cops
- No shock vs taze balance (cops could taze 3 times whether shocked or not, and if shocked then they could taze 3+1 per shock)
- No weapon/item/drug racks and super vehicles (which is a big plus, cops don’t even have all that upon spawn and it's their job)

Now going back even further, in 2014:
- Cophunting was not allowed (you could only fire back if a LEO shot you first)

Do you see the difference between now and then? Taking into consideration there were no complaints, criminal activity was high, same as playercount, how can one claim the reason players do not commit crimes anymore is because of the recent updates? Is it maybe because a certain group of people is highly against it?

---

After this implementation a player came to me and told me:

''Those updates are so bad. I was trying to kill three cops alone and they managed to arrest me.''

This only showed to me how over-powered criminals used to be before this minor update.

I think some of us don't really understand what a CnR server really is. We have started believing it's more of a TDM, and we (staff team) take the blame for that as I have said multiple times. In a CnR server cop-hunting does not exist, your goal is to escape from cops, not hunt them. In a CnR server you don't get items, weapons and drugs for free upon spawn, you buy them from others. In a CnR server you don't type a command to get wanted. And many other things. Just because you, I or they like doing and having all those above it doesn't mean that's how it should be. Now I am not claiming we should bring all that back, however saying ''I want this server to start becoming more of what it used to be be'' yet still supporting all of the mentioned is an ironic thing to say. It's just one person contradicting himself.

We should all step out from our comfort zone and start realising that this is a Cops and Robbers and not a Team Deathmatch server. We have got used to having everything upon spawn with minimal to zero effort, that's why a slight nerf causes such distaste. You shouldn't expect to win a 1v2 fight. Let alone a 1v3. Those updates were purely cop-related and they were fairly insignificant. Most cops are not even skilled enough because they are new to the game. They used to get shock-killed and later on leave the server. If you don't want to commit a crime anymore just because now you need to be better equipped and actually put effort then I am sorry but you don't want to play in a actual CnR server.

From what we can see there is a diversity of opinions in this topic, and it's normal the ones who are against it to post in this thread rather than the ones who are fine with it. I can assure you there are many more players who are happy with this update yet decided not to write here. The cops vs criminals arguement has been on-going since 2017 or so and it has come to a point where some will just be unsatisfied no matter what we do.

[Ducati.]

I would now suggest to remove bm and rest of criminal perks. Will it make it equal for both sides? According to yes.
Because it is just not good that you start comparing it with past situations. Swat also don't have the feature of shock bomb, climb etc. Police vip, etc.

By saying that there was no such complaints when there was no bm and these things, you just want to convince that earlier gameplay was better. So why not bring that again?
I really was not in favour of writing this all. But when I see such comparison everytime in such suggestions it makes me think this.

[Uzzwal.]

I would now suggest to remove bm and rest of criminal perks. Will it make it equal for both sides? According to yes.
Because it is just not good that you start comparing it with past situations. Swat also don't have the feature of shock bomb, climb etc. Police vip, etc.

By saying that there was no such complaints when there was no bm and these things, you just want to convince that earlier gameplay was better. So why not bring that again?
I really was not in favour of writing this all. But when I see such comparison everytime in such suggestions it makes me think this.

Okay here you are trying to turn Mastro's point in another direction again, He's not comparing past but he's is telling that This is Cops and Robbers and not Team Deathmatch server(TDM)
but nowadays suggestions and replies are more related to TDM features. Mastro also explained what is Cops and Robbers server and how this category of gameplay works. Game offers CNR not TDM, so he's trying to say do not try to promote TDM in CNR server.
If you talk about past there were Roadblocks, climb etc except few things for SWAT.
He explained very clearly everything about Cops and Robbers gameplay.

[BeaTen.]

I would now suggest to remove bm and rest of criminal perks. Will it make it equal for both sides? According to yes.
Because it is just not good that you start comparing it with past situations. Swat also don't have the feature of shock bomb, climb etc. Police vip, etc.

By saying that there was no such complaints when there was no bm and these things, you just want to convince that earlier gameplay was better. So why not bring that again?
I really was not in favour of writing this all. But when I see such comparison everytime in such suggestions it makes me think this.

SWAT didn't have shock bomb, it had an explosive bomb, which was ironically replaced with the shock bomb because criminals told that it was not 'fitting' with the SWAT team since SWAT is supposed to arrest and not kill. So they replaced it with something not lethal at all, and now still everyone complains.
Criminals didn't have black market, remove black market and remove swclimb, and add previous bomb, sounds fair right? I totally agree with this.

[Ducati.]

I would now suggest to remove bm and rest of criminal perks. Will it make it equal for both sides? According to yes.
Because it is just not good that you start comparing it with past situations. Swat also don't have the feature of shock bomb, climb etc. Police vip, etc.

By saying that there was no such complaints when there was no bm and these things, you just want to convince that earlier gameplay was better. So why not bring that again?
I really was not in favour of writing this all. But when I see such comparison everytime in such suggestions it makes me think this.

Okay here you are trying to turn Mastro's point in another direction again, He's not comparing past but he's is telling that This is Cops and Robbers and not Team Deathmatch server(TDM)
but nowadays suggestions and replies are more related to TDM features. Mastro also explained what is Cops and Robbers server and how this category of gameplay works. Game offers CNR not TDM, so he's trying to say do not try to promote TDM in CNR server.
If you talk about past there were Roadblocks, climb etc except few things for SWAT.
He explained very clearly everything about Cops and Robbers gameplay.

Oh really brother?

To the ones who claim how cops are really powerful now, I would like to remind you how things used to be back in 2015. Keep in mind there were very few complaints about 'balance', and criminal activity was way higher than now (in case one claims now it's low because of the recent updates):

- Cuff range was way longer (now you have to be fairly close)
- There was no Blackmarket
- No taze reflector
- No ability to move whilst cuffed
- Unlimited cuffs for cops
- No shock vs taze balance (cops could taze 3 times whether shocked or not, and if shocked then they could taze 3+1 per shock)
- No weapon/item/drug racks and super vehicles (which is a big plus, cops don’t even have all that upon spawn and it's their job)

Now going back even further, in 2014:
- Cophunting was not allowed (you could only fire back if a LEO shot you first)

Do you see the difference between now and then? Taking into consideration there were no complaints, criminal activity was high, same as playercount, how can one claim the reason players do not commit crimes anymore is because of the recent updates? Is it maybe because a certain group of people is highly against it?
.

I will not tag him as I expect these types of comparisons everytime.

But luckily I have never seen such comparisons in cop buffing suggestions. Because that's where most of your soft side is.
And there are many blind followers such as you.


I agree with you beaten. Lets revert it back and I don't want anyone to write this furthermore.

[Mastro]

I would now suggest to remove bm and rest of criminal perks. Will it make it equal for both sides? According to yes.
Because it is just not good that you start comparing it with past situations. Swat also don't have the feature of shock bomb, climb etc. Police vip, etc.

By saying that there was no such complaints when there was no bm and these things, you just want to convince that earlier gameplay was better. So why not bring that again?
I really was not in favour of writing this all. But when I see such comparison everytime in such suggestions it makes me think this.

I never said it was equal, it wasn't, that's why things are not like that anymore of course. However, the reason why I made this comparison is to show you guys how weak criminals used to be, yet there were very few complaints and a high criminal activity. Saying it since I have seen a couple claiming again and again that all of the recent updates have caused issues. That simply shows we are not willing to put significant effort and only shock-kill every cop who approaches, hence why this strong distaste by a certain group of people when we make such minor tweaks.

For the record, I forgot to mention that SWAT bomb used to be way more over-powered too, instant kill, unlike now. Lethal. It wasn't as easy to escape from it. As for SWAT climb, it is rank restricted as far as I know, it is barely being used and the chances to fail are high. The past two years we have been constantly buffing criminals, not LEOs. That's a fact. You can't really say we have a "soft side" for cops because it's not true. I was personally against cops having so much power back then, suggested things such as reducing cuff range and whatnot. Don't make invalid statements please.

Server certainly used to feel more like a CnR than it does now for sure. The gameplay was better, yes, we can't just fully revert everything to how it was though. That's not possible anymore and it is our fault we accepted such in the first place. But that's not the point. The point here is that we are complaining about a minor only cop-related update that was requested by the majority simply because police officers were standing no chance against wanted players. They were objectively so vulnerable yet I didn't see you creating a suggestion about this.

Criminals are still extremely powerful, despite the fact that they shouldn't be having all those perks if we followed the "CnR" concept to begin with. Most of you have super vehicles upon spawn, free drugs upon spawn, free weapons upon spawn, free items upon spawn and so on. Cops don't even have all that and it's their job. It is certainly harder to kill a cop now, yes, that was the whole purpose of this implementation. But the chances are pretty much equal now. This topic was created the same day those updates were pushed to the main and you guys did not even wait to see how things would turn out. As I said I have had a player tell me how it's impossible to kill cops in a 1v3 fight nowadays. Isn't that how it is supposed to be since you are out-numbered? Doesn't that clearly show that there was a major imbalance?

Get out of the comfort zone and start realising that this is a Cops and Robbers server. You have to be good at the game and work hard to accomplish any goals. You are in a group? Team up. Out-number them. Get a mechanic with you. Let someone spawn as salesman to sell you shock guns and whatnot. One as a drug dealer. Play smart. Criminals ought to be weaker than LEOs, even though they truly aren't at this point. We all get annoyed by this simply because we believe it's natural for them to hunt cops. It's not. It's the other way around. We have this "Team Deathmatch" feel in our minds, thinking it's a group versus another group thing, where both teams should be completely equal.

[Uzzwal.]

It's not worth to reply people who are just trying to promote TDM here. If they are really fond of TDM why dont they join TDM server instead of opening suggestion topic and suggesting something which just promotes TDM

[Karu_Tepes]

I think Mastro nailed this one. This is a CnR ROLEPLAY server. The fact there is cop hunting and TDM is completely different from even the name. Los Santos Roleplay Cops and Robbers. (LSRCR). This was supposed to be a cops and robbers roleplay server, it shows in the very name. Do you know how often the police here RP? Never. Do you know how often criminals RP here? Occasionally. Do you know how often people are treating this place like a TDM? Constantly!

I don't support cop hunting. It's stupid. Do I think we should disallow a clearly criminal group from doing it? No. If they want to consider that a mission, let them. But the cops need to understand that not everyone is a cophunter. Many of us are just normal players who would love to RP a pull over and such. When the cops do /pu I always pull over and RP with them. I find it fun. But it's pretty rare that they do it. I think half the cops here don't know /pu even exists.

Another big issue is non-english players and literal children here. There is a user here who I swear has to be around 12, speaks no english, and constantly breaks the rules. He was warned...and warned...and warned...and given TWO 3-day bans. Do you think he's stopped? If you do, you're a moron. I understand being polite and giving second and even third chances. If someone breaks the rules, tell them about it. If they break the same rule over and over, ban them. If they STILL break the rules, consider getting rid of them. I understand banning regular players is bad, because it lowers the server player count, but I think having such blatently rulebreaking players who LAUGH when you explain the rules and curse you out lowers it even more.

As Mastro said, this topic was made on the same day as the update. I doubt anyone even got SWAT bombed by the time this was made. I think you all read the update notes, and made this before even giving it a chance. Because lets face it, you're weak. Even with all the perks criminals have over cops, you want more? Their tazers are useless. Their vehicles are slow. They no longer have numbers. When they do have numbers, group hunt them like prey. The cops here are at a huge disadvantage. And yet because your egos are in constant need of stroking and you need that score and kill list to feel good about yourselves, you'll bitch and moan to get your own way. Simply put, you guys suck at the roleplay and cops and robbers gamemode and want the staff to cater to your every whim even if it destroys the server.

And that is what you need to understand the most. You are DESTROYING this server. I hear so many complaints from older players about how this server is dying because of the TDM and new players. It breaks my heart to see so many older users giving up. I wish I had played years ago when this server was in it's prime. I could have offered advice and such on how to improve it and stop this TDM feel. Now however, we need to make a choice. Do we continue the TDM feel, or do we add back roleplay and CnR, make things more balanced, and hope things stabilize and older members return?

We've had enough guys. End this argument. EIGHT PAGES of ego stroking, cop hunting, weak players who need the staff to build them special tricks to defeat the police because you can't do anything but duel is too much. The SWAT bomb is fine. The arguing about everything else isn't. This thread is a train wreck. It should be locked.

[Zoroark]

-1 you took eternity seriously LOL all he does is dm, bug abuse and rule break and has no interest in balance.


For me the best way to balance all of this to make all LEOs drag. (Because TP arrest gives almost no chance to get away)