
[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:As i said I didn't read what i quoted and I'm not even interested in proving anything to anyone or arguing about it, lol.The_Fury wrote:Seminal vesicles, cowper's glands and the prostate gland contribute to 95% of the semen and these glands may be close to the backbone. But they are NOWHERE near the ribs and and they're a LOT closer to the testicles than to the backbone.[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:We still haven't got our answers. Why is it written in the Quran that sperm emerges between the backbone and the ribs when it clearly doesn't? When I asked this, I was asked to watch the videos of Dr. Zakir Naik. His videos make little sense, at least not to me. So, can you explain why that is written in the Quran?Its a common allegation which is made against the Quran. The Quran implies that semen production takes place in the kidney or back area citing the verses:
[86:6-8] "Now let man but think from what he is created! He is created from a drop emitted -Proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs:"
The allegation, in the words of Dr. William Campbell is as follows;
“Since the verse is speaking of the moment of adult reproduction it can't be talking about the time of embryonic development. Moreover, since 'sulb' is being used in conjunction with 'gushing fluid', which can only be physical; and 'tara'ib' which is another physical word for chest or thorax or ribs, it can't be euphemistic. Therefore, we are left with the very real problem that the semen is coming from the back or kidney area and not the testicles.”
What Qur’an Says
[76:3] We have created man from a mingled sperm-drop that We might try him; so We made him hearing, seeing.
[86:6] So let man consider from what he is created.
[86:7] He is created from a gushing fluid,
[86:8] Which issues forth from between the loins and the breast-bones.
[86:9] Surely, He has the power to bring him back to life
EXPLANATION
The allegation is based on false premises that the Qur’an talks about semen coming out of the area between backbone and ribs.
DID THE QUR’AN USE THE WORD “SEMEN”? NOT AT ALL.
The Qur’an used the words, “Khuliqa minm Maain Daafiq”, that was translated by Sir Zafrullah Khan as, “created from a fluid poured forth” and by Maulvi Sher Ali as, “created from a gushing fluid”. These four words mean the ejaculate, which consists of 2-5% sperms and 95-98% other ingredients. Therefore only 2-5 % of the fluid is produced in testes. The majority of the other ingredients, including prostaglandins, Zinc, lipids, steroid hormones, enzymes, amino acids and minerals, are produced and stored in the seminal vesicles, and prostate glands, both of which are located very close to the backbone.
DID THE QUR’AN USE THE WORD “KIDNEY”? NO.
Furthermore, we should try to discover what is that present in between the backbone and the ribs that causes the seminal fluid to be issued or expelled. In order to understand this verse, we must recollect the anatomy and the physiology of the spinal cord, vertebral column, and the autonomic nervous system. Briefly, without going into biological and physiological details, the reflex centres in the spinal cord begin to send nerve signals or emit rhythmic sympathetic impulses that leave the cord at lumbar segments L1, L2 and pass to the genitalia. Next, the last wave of reflex nervous mechanism takes place. Rhythmic parasympathetic impulses from the sacral segment S1, S2 leave the cord resulting in the expulsion or ejaculation or forcing out the “gushing fluid”.
The spinal cord ends at the level between first and second lumbar vertebrae. The spinal segments, L1, L2 and S1, S2 are enclosed within the first and second lumbar vertebrae, which are below the thoracic ones where the ribs meet the backbone. Thus we have seen that the nerve signals to expel the ejaculate or the “gushing fluid” is issued from the lumbar and sacral segments of the spinal cord, which lie below the level of the 12th ribs on either side and above L3 vertebra or “between the backbone and the ribs,” as the Qur’an says.
SUMMARY
Briefly, the Holy Qur’an is absolutely right in using the above words literally and scientifically too. All knowledge is in the Qur’an but some intellects are the one who fail to grasp it. The above mentioned physiological mechanism of ejaculation of the fluid and how the nerve impulses are discharged from the lumbar and sacral segments of the spinal cord that lie within the first two lumbar vertebrae, which are below the 12th ribs and above the remaining lumbar and sacral vertebrae, the backbone. Is there any doubt what the Qur’an uniquely summarizes it, the nerve impulses are discharged “ Don't know if this answers you or not didn't even read lmfao and not interested in such arguments/topics
We're missing the point here. If Quran is as perfect as you say, then why are things written like this? These verses are clearly not perfect nor clear.
The_Fury wrote:lol[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:As i said I didn't read what i quoted and I'm not even interested in proving anything to anyone or arguing about it, lol.The_Fury wrote: Its a common allegation which is made against the Quran. The Quran implies that semen production takes place in the kidney or back area citing the verses:Seminal vesicles, cowper's glands and the prostate gland contribute to 95% of the semen and these glands may be close to the backbone. But they are NOWHERE near the ribs and and they're a LOT closer to the testicles than to the backbone.
[86:6-8] "Now let man but think from what he is created! He is created from a drop emitted -Proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs:"
The allegation, in the words of Dr. William Campbell is as follows;
“Since the verse is speaking of the moment of adult reproduction it can't be talking about the time of embryonic development. Moreover, since 'sulb' is being used in conjunction with 'gushing fluid', which can only be physical; and 'tara'ib' which is another physical word for chest or thorax or ribs, it can't be euphemistic. Therefore, we are left with the very real problem that the semen is coming from the back or kidney area and not the testicles.”
What Qur’an Says
[76:3] We have created man from a mingled sperm-drop that We might try him; so We made him hearing, seeing.
[86:6] So let man consider from what he is created.
[86:7] He is created from a gushing fluid,
[86:8] Which issues forth from between the loins and the breast-bones.
[86:9] Surely, He has the power to bring him back to life
EXPLANATION
The allegation is based on false premises that the Qur’an talks about semen coming out of the area between backbone and ribs.
DID THE QUR’AN USE THE WORD “SEMEN”? NOT AT ALL.
The Qur’an used the words, “Khuliqa minm Maain Daafiq”, that was translated by Sir Zafrullah Khan as, “created from a fluid poured forth” and by Maulvi Sher Ali as, “created from a gushing fluid”. These four words mean the ejaculate, which consists of 2-5% sperms and 95-98% other ingredients. Therefore only 2-5 % of the fluid is produced in testes. The majority of the other ingredients, including prostaglandins, Zinc, lipids, steroid hormones, enzymes, amino acids and minerals, are produced and stored in the seminal vesicles, and prostate glands, both of which are located very close to the backbone.
DID THE QUR’AN USE THE WORD “KIDNEY”? NO.
Furthermore, we should try to discover what is that present in between the backbone and the ribs that causes the seminal fluid to be issued or expelled. In order to understand this verse, we must recollect the anatomy and the physiology of the spinal cord, vertebral column, and the autonomic nervous system. Briefly, without going into biological and physiological details, the reflex centres in the spinal cord begin to send nerve signals or emit rhythmic sympathetic impulses that leave the cord at lumbar segments L1, L2 and pass to the genitalia. Next, the last wave of reflex nervous mechanism takes place. Rhythmic parasympathetic impulses from the sacral segment S1, S2 leave the cord resulting in the expulsion or ejaculation or forcing out the “gushing fluid”.
The spinal cord ends at the level between first and second lumbar vertebrae. The spinal segments, L1, L2 and S1, S2 are enclosed within the first and second lumbar vertebrae, which are below the thoracic ones where the ribs meet the backbone. Thus we have seen that the nerve signals to expel the ejaculate or the “gushing fluid” is issued from the lumbar and sacral segments of the spinal cord, which lie below the level of the 12th ribs on either side and above L3 vertebra or “between the backbone and the ribs,” as the Qur’an says.
SUMMARY
Briefly, the Holy Qur’an is absolutely right in using the above words literally and scientifically too. All knowledge is in the Qur’an but some intellects are the one who fail to grasp it. The above mentioned physiological mechanism of ejaculation of the fluid and how the nerve impulses are discharged from the lumbar and sacral segments of the spinal cord that lie within the first two lumbar vertebrae, which are below the 12th ribs and above the remaining lumbar and sacral vertebrae, the backbone. Is there any doubt what the Qur’an uniquely summarizes it, the nerve impulses are discharged “ Don't know if this answers you or not didn't even read lmfao and not interested in such arguments/topics
We're missing the point here. If Quran is as perfect as you say, then why are things written like this? These verses are clearly not perfect nor clear.
Edit: And I've seen something about '' qur'an'' didn't say ''semen'' or something like that in the above check that or idk, lol not really interested.

[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:Seminal vesicles, cowper's glands and the prostate gland contribute to 95% of the semen and these glands may be close to the backbone. But they are NOWHERE near the ribs and and they're a LOT closer to the testicles than to the backbone.Qur'an is perfectly clear for those who know or have learned classical Arabic.
We're missing the point here. If Quran is as perfect as you say, then why are things written like this? These verses are clearly not perfect nor clear.
GreaTSaN wrote:So you're telling me that translating Quran is where everything goes wrong?[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:Seminal vesicles, cowper's glands and the prostate gland contribute to 95% of the semen and these glands may be close to the backbone. But they are NOWHERE near the ribs and and they're a LOT closer to the testicles than to the backbone.Qur'an is perfectly clear for those who know or have learned classical Arabic.
We're missing the point here. If Quran is as perfect as you say, then why are things written like this? These verses are clearly not perfect nor clear.
As for the explanation Fury posted, I was about to add that but I decided not to confirm some Arabic words from an Arab so I'd not be questioned afterwards. I'd talk about that verse soon as soon as my research is completed. I'd also reply to all questions asked by Cx after a while.

[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:Yes mostly people change verses with their own words which is not right. Not all translations can be incorrect and not all words from Arabic to English can be translated. It's better to read Qur'an with authentic translation or get some help from an Arab who have knowledge of classical Arabic so he would tell you the meanings of words which you're in doubt of or which are not available. Google translator wouldn't help anybody. By the way, have you read whole Qur'an once?GreaTSaN wrote:So you're telling me that translating Quran is where everything goes wrong?[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:Seminal vesicles, cowper's glands and the prostate gland contribute to 95% of the semen and these glands may be close to the backbone. But they are NOWHERE near the ribs and and they're a LOT closer to the testicles than to the backbone.Qur'an is perfectly clear for those who know or have learned classical Arabic.
We're missing the point here. If Quran is as perfect as you say, then why are things written like this? These verses are clearly not perfect nor clear.
As for the explanation Fury posted, I was about to add that but I decided not to confirm some Arabic words from an Arab so I'd not be questioned afterwards. I'd talk about that verse soon as soon as my research is completed. I'd also reply to all questions asked by Cx after a while.
GreaTSaN wrote:Why would I read it if it's written in a language that I don't speak and the translations are wrong? Besides, I've never even read my own religion's books. I prefer science as it's more accurate.[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:Yes mostly people change verses with their own words which is not right. Not all translations can be incorrect and not all words from Arabic to English can be translated. It's better to read Qur'an with authentic translation or get some help from an Arab who have knowledge of classical Arabic so he would tell you the meanings of words which you're in doubt of or which are not available. Google translator wouldn't help anybody. By the way, have you read whole Qur'an once?GreaTSaN wrote: Qur'an is perfectly clear for those who know or have learned classical Arabic.So you're telling me that translating Quran is where everything goes wrong?
As for the explanation Fury posted, I was about to add that but I decided not to confirm some Arabic words from an Arab so I'd not be questioned afterwards. I'd talk about that verse soon as soon as my research is completed. I'd also reply to all questions asked by Cx after a while.

[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:Yeah you prefer science and not religion without even understand what your or other religion says. Go on with that. I'm not gonna force you to do something which you don't like. Indeed, there shall be a time when we both would know what was right and what's not. And I never said all translations are wrong. Just get translations from a trusted source instead of random websites from Google.GreaTSaN wrote:Why would I read it if it's written in a language that I don't speak and the translations are wrong? Besides, I've never even read my own religion's books. I prefer science as it's more accurate.[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote: So you're telling me that translating Quran is where everything goes wrong?Yes mostly people change verses with their own words which is not right. Not all translations can be incorrect and not all words from Arabic to English can be translated. It's better to read Qur'an with authentic translation or get some help from an Arab who have knowledge of classical Arabic so he would tell you the meanings of words which you're in doubt of or which are not available. Google translator wouldn't help anybody. By the way, have you read whole Qur'an once?
GreaTSaN wrote:I already know what's wrong and what's not.[Lsrcr]Oggy wrote:Yeah you prefer science and not religion without even understand what your or other religion says. Go on with that. I'm not gonna force you to do something which you don't like. Indeed, there shall be a time when we both would know what was right and what's not. And I never said all translations are wrong. Just get translations from a trusted source instead of random websites from Google.GreaTSaN wrote: Yes mostly people change verses with their own words which is not right. Not all translations can be incorrect and not all words from Arabic to English can be translated. It's better to read Qur'an with authentic translation or get some help from an Arab who have knowledge of classical Arabic so he would tell you the meanings of words which you're in doubt of or which are not available. Google translator wouldn't help anybody. By the way, have you read whole Qur'an once?Why would I read it if it's written in a language that I don't speak and the translations are wrong? Besides, I've never even read my own religion's books. I prefer science as it's more accurate.

CXdur wrote:It seems very clear to me that the Qur'an implies the earth is flat, you didn't really say anything to disprove this. Yes, of course the earth appears flat and spread out to someone who is standing on the ground. Can you find anywhere in the Qur'an where it specifically states the earth is round? Because from what I see, it refers to the earth as a spread out carpet several times.It does mention about it being spherical and not flat. Let's look at the verse from chapter 39 verse 5 (literal meaning):
This only further proves my point. If Allah is all-knowing, he shouldn't have referred to it the way most people would at the time. In today's time, I have a very hard time believing anyone would describe the earth like this, especially several times without mentioning the fact that it is actually round.
He wraps the night over the day and wraps the day over the night and has subjected the sun and the moon, each running [its course] for a specified term.Now before I proceed, let me tell you that not all words are available in English to be translated and not all words from Arabic to English can be translated. Qur'an even mentions to ponder and reflect upon the verses. You can't simply understand a book without pondering upon the verses which is sent down from someone who's the most high. If you were an Arab with the knowledge of classical Arabic then it'd not be a problem but anyways I'd explain to you the verse. The word used in this verse "yukavviru" means "to wrap" in English but if we go a little bit deeper and try to understand this word then it'd come out with multiple meanings. This word "yukavviru" in classical Arabic specifically means "to wrap something on head or spherical object" and is mostly used to wrap turban around head. In the verse the word "yukavviru" is specifically used instead of word "yalufu" which simply means "to wrap anything". Now with this in mind, it is very simple to understand that the one who sent this book is telling us that Earth is spherical and not flat. If we take a look at other verses where he says "spread out" he means that it's spread out in a way that it doesn't seem round to us when we're standing on it. If you climb up on a mountain and look around you'd see everything flat instead of curve endings or round shape. That's what it actually means. You can confirm these words from an Arabic translator.
Arabic: khalaakas samavati val aardaa bil haakk(haakki), yukavvirul layla aalan nahari va yakavvirun naheara layli va shaarash shamsa val kaamar
CXdur wrote:I already explained you these verses on Facebook but for others to understand as well, I'd reply here with the explanation. The verses you quoted is from Chapter 55 verse 33 but to understand the verses of Qur'an, you've to read the whole chapter or whole book not specifically a single verse (as I said before). Now look at the following verses before this and after this verse:GreaTSaN wrote: It looks like you don't have enough knowledge of science that's why you're asking this question. Do you think that clouds that forms above are just weightless? Do you think clouds are heavy or light? Maybe you'd say light but Qur'an stated 1400 years ago that clouds were not light at all but instead they could be very heavy. Sounds stupid, right? Let's look into these verse: (interpretation of the meaning)Don't question my knowledge of science, we learned this in children's school and I thought everyone knew this. The Qur'an strongly implies that the sky is impetrenable, suggesting flights or rockets can't go through it. It also says that a piece of the sky can drop down on a person. I never said that clouds were weightless and I have no idea how you can dismiss all my arguments by assuming I don't know this.
The Qur'an does however say that you can pass through the sky with Allah's permission. "Allah says: “O assembly of Jinn and men! If you can pass beyond the zones of the heavens and the Earth, then pass! Not without authority shall you be able to pass!” [Sûrah al-Rahmân: 33]"
Strangely enough, NASA did not ask for Allah's permission.
We will attend to you, O prominent beings.Now if you read it out carefully, you'd understand that the author (God) is talking about the Day of Judgement and not the present itself. "We will attend to you" which is the hour (Day of Resurrection, explained many times in The Qur'an) and it'll be said "pass beyond the regions but you will not except by authority or permission" which clearly means that on that Day no one will be able to escape or run away from the Judgement. "This is hell, which the criminals deny" which means that it was all a topic of Day of Judgement. You can read the whole chapter yourself to understand it as I've quoted just a limited amount of verses not whole chapter. I hope it's all clear now.
O company of jinn and mankind, if you are able to pass beyond the regions of the heavens and the earth, then pass. You will not pass except by authority.
There will be sent upon you a flame of fire and smoke, and you will not defend yourselves.
And when the heaven is split open and becomes rose-colored like oil - Then on that Day none will be asked about his sin among men or jinn.
The criminals will be known by their marks, and they will be seized by the forelocks and the feet.
This is Hell, which the criminals deny.- Qur'an 55:31-43
CXdur wrote:Were the Earth & heavens joined together or split apart?
(21:30) Split apart (41:11) Joined together
The verse 21:30 says that the earth and heaven was split apart while 41:11 says they were joined together.Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe? - Qur'an 21:30What are you talking about?
Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly." - Qur'an 41:11
CXdur wrote:How many angels participated at the Battle of Badr?
(8:9) 1,000 angels. (3:123-124) 3,000 angels.
Verse 8:9 says that 1000 angels participated in the battle while 3:123-124 says 3000. Would an all-knowing god make this mistake?[Remember] when you asked help of your Lord, and He answered you, "Indeed, I will reinforce you with a thousand from the angels, following one another." - Qur'an 8:9These two verses do not contradict one another at all, nor is there any inconsistency whatsoever, once one quotes the Arabic text properly and understands what is being said.
And already had Allah given you victory at [the battle of] Badr while you were few in number. Then fear Allah ; perhaps you will be grateful. - Qur'an 3:123
[Remember] when you said to the believers, "Is it not sufficient for you that your Lord should reinforce you with three thousand angels sent down? - Qur'an 3:124
Yes, if you remain patient and conscious of Allah and the enemy come upon you [attacking] in rage, your Lord will reinforce you with five thousand angels having marks [of distinction] - Qur'an 3:125
The two verses, which occur in two different chapters in the Quran, both ask the Prophet (peace be upon him) to recount how Allah Most High promised to send His angels to strengthen the believers when they were sorely outnumbered by their oppressors at Badr. It is not a report of the actual numbers.
Not a contradiction.
CXdur wrote:How long is Judgement Day?I'd repeat my same sentence again, if you'd have read the Qur'an you'd have not asked such questions. This verse from Chapter 22 explains clearly about the days. Verse 47: "And they urge you to hasten the punishment. But Allah will never fail in His promise. And indeed, a day with your Lord is like a thousand years of those which you count.". You can get the literal meanings by hovering word by word or either ask a arabic user and he would agree with the same. So 50000 / 1000 = 50. It's pretty clear for those with knowledge and I hope you understood this too now and wouldn't mention this as contradiction anymore.
(32:5) 1,000 Earth years (70:4) 50,000 Earth years
Again, a contradiction. Verse 32:5 says judgement day is 1000 years long and 70:4 says 50000 years.
CXdur wrote:There's also a historical error, Muhammed mixes up Mirian and the Virgin Mary in the bible. The bible says that Miriam is Aaron's sister, while the Qur'an says that Virgin Mary is Aaron's sister. The Bible says Miriam is the daughter of Amram, while the Qur'an says that Virgin Mary is the daughter of Imran. The author has clearly mistaken Miriam for Mary in the bible.Good question and I came up with the same question when I started reciting this Surah (chapter) couple of months ago but hopefully I got an answer for this from a source which I'm going to paste here. If Muhammad (PBUH) was to commit such a historic mistake from Bible then he would have done so on lots of other places but apparently there's none and this is not a mistake at all.Source: Message of Qur'an wrote:The Quran refers to Mary, upon her be peace, as the “sister of Aaron” in reference to her descent from the lineage of the Prophet Aaron, upon him be peace. This type of reference is common in ancient Semitic languages and in the Bible.So it's clear now that the verse is not a historical mistake but a perfect agreement with Semitic languages and ancient custom.
God said: "O sister of Aaron, your father was not a man of evil, nor was your mother unchaste." - Qur'an 19:28
The Christians at the time of the Prophet objected to this verse on the grounds that it was meant literally, but the Prophet answered their question.
Mughira b. Shu'ba reported: "When I came to Najran, they (the Christians of Najran) asked me: You read" O sister of Harun" (i. e. Mary, mother of Jesus) in the Qur'an, whereas Moses was born much before Jesus. When I came back to Allah's Messenger (PBUH) I asked him about that, whereupon he said: The (people of the old age) used to give names (to their persons) after the names of Apostles and pious persons who had gone before them.". You can find this Hadith in Arabic to confirm it yourself .
Muhammad Asad comments on the verse, saying: In ancient Semitic usage, a person’s name was often linked with that of a renowned ancestor or founder of the tribal line. Thus, for instance, a man of the tribe of Banu Tamim was sometimes addressed as “son of Tamim” or “brother of Tamim.” Since Mary belonged to the priestly caste, and hence descended from Aaron, the brother of Moses, she was called a “sister of Aaron,” in the same way as her cousin Elizabeth, the wife of Zachariah, is spoken of in Luke 1:5 as one of “the daughters of Aaron.”
If Prophet Muhammad was to copy stuff from Bible, he would have done so with the story of Moses, and other stories regarding Jesus (peace be upon him). I hope it's all clear now.
Some of your questions are not answered because I haven't done any research on them before but I'm doing now. I've a little bit of knowledge on that which won't help you understand anything so it's better for me to first understand myself and then tell you what it really is. Considering the fact that all verses which you thought were contradictions are in actual just a misunderstanding and if you read carefully with whole chapter then it's pretty much clear. Sometimes you may encounter issues with translations in English and that is something related to translations not Qur'an because (I've said this plenty of times) some Arabic words cannot be translated in other languages. Hope I explained everything to you and if you've any questions, feel free to ask. Islam doesn't stop you from asking questions. May God bless you and guide you.CXdur wrote:IT IS VERY IMPORTANT to point out that the Qur'an claims it is meant to be clear in meaning. (Quran 5:15, 6:55, 6:114, 11:1, 16:103, 22:16, 41:3) states that it is. 5:15 goes as follows "O followers of the Book! indeed Our Messenger has come to you making clear to you much of what you concealed of the Book and passing over much; indeed, there has come to you light and a clear Book from Allah;" In 3:7 however it does say that some verses are allegorical.Good question, bro. Indeed, The Qur'an is a clear and divine book with precise verses for those who seek for guidance and knowledge but it should also be noted that Qur'an is not very much clear in English version because not all words can be translated but for those who speak Arabic and have knowledge of classical Arabic can understand it perfectly. There's no doubt in the verses of Qur'an but you question then why does God say that some interpretation of verses are only known to God. Basically, there are some chapters in the Qur'an which starts with certain Arabic letters (i.e Alif, Laam, Meem in Chapter 2 or Ya-Sin in Chapter 36).
These letters are from Arabic but it's still not clear why they're used in these chapters. What's the actual meaning of these letters and why it's mostly used when God talks about something related to Qur'an on the next verse. There are 28 different chapters where different letters are used but their meanings are unknown to us. There are many theories given by many scholars but none really explains the reason of these words or meanings of these words. That's all it is.
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests