Qur'an and Science

[[Lsrcr]Oggy]

Miracle #5: Darkness in the sea and internal waves.

In deep seas and oceans, the darkness is found at a depth of 200 meters and deeper. At this depth, there is almost no light, and below a depth of 1,000 meters there is no light at all.

Today, we know about the general formation of the sea, the characteristics of the living things in it, its salinity, as well as the amount of water it contains, and its surface area and depth. Submarines and special equipment, developed with modern technology, have enabled scientists to obtain such information.

God mentions in Chapter 24:40:

Or like utter darkness in the deep sea: there covers it a wave above which is another wave, above which is a cloud, (layers of) utter darkness one above another; when he holds out his hand, he is almost unable to see it; and to whomsoever Allah does not give light, he has no light.

Human beings are not able to dive to a depth of more than 70 meters without the aid of special equipment. They cannot survive unaided in the dark depths of the oceans, such as at a depth of 200 meters. For these reasons, scientists have only recently been able to discover detailed information about the seas. However, that the depth of the sea is dark was revealed in the Qur'an 1,400 years ago. It is certainly one of the miracles of the Qur'an that such information was given at a time where no equipment to enable man to dive into the depths of the oceans was available.

Furthermore attention is drawn in the verse "...there covers it a wave above which is another wave, above which is a cloud, (layers of) utter darkness one above another...". Scientists have only recently discovered that there are sub-surface waves, which "occur on density interfaces between layers of different densities." These internal waves cover the deep waters of seas and oceans because deep water has a higher density than the water above it. Internal waves act like surface waves. They can break, just like surface waves. Internal waves cannot be discerned by the human eye, but they can be detected by studying temperature or salinity changes at a given location.

Here's the verse in Arabic:

أَوْ كَظُلُمَاتٍ فِي بَحْرٍ لُّجِّيٍّ يَغْشَاهُ مَوْجٌ مِّن فَوْقِهِ مَوْجٌ مِّن فَوْقِهِ سَحَابٌ ۚ ظُلُمَاتٌ بَعْضُهَا فَوْقَ بَعْضٍ إِذَا أَخْرَجَ يَدَهُ لَمْ يَكَدْ يَرَاهَا ۗ وَمَن لَّمْ يَجْعَلِ اللَّهُ لَهُ نُورًا فَمَا لَهُ مِن نُّورٍ - 24:40

For those who are willing to do more research in Arabic language. Here's the link for dictionary so that people won't come up and say I have twisted the words.

Source:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_wave
* Explanation is copied from Harun Yahya.

Have you ever looked into the sea? If not, then look now:

Just look at this picture. It's pretty obvious from this that the sea gets darker and darker by depth. Not at all a miracle.

[GreaTSaN]

Day and night don't literally "wrap" around the earth. The word is used here metaphorically. So you can't take all the parts of a metaphorical word literally. The translators used don't really say that the word means wrapping around a spherical object. They say the word means to coil up or to roll up and the word 'around' isn't mentioned anywhere.

Let's take the metaphor "Rainbow of love" for instance. If you take the literal meanings of these words, does that mean reflection, refraction and dispersion causes love (I laughed too) as they are what causes the rainbow?

Radii and diameters are properties of circles or spheres only.

You are wrong. They are the properties of cylinders as well.

Now I'd appreciate if you could explain the verses I gave you. Science doesn't explain anything using metaphors but religions do because then the words can be twisted and turned accordingly and that's the difference between science books and holy books.

You're so good in rejecting things even after you get sufficient proofs. How can you assume yourself that the verse in metaphorically? While the word used in the verse means a ball or to round like a ball and you're here just coming up with your own things. Ask an Arabic speaker if you don't have a good source to do your research. When we recite Qur'an we know when the verse is literal and metaphorical. One such example is when Qur'an says: "Deaf, dumb and blind so they'll not come to guidance" it doesn't literally means that they're blind and we can clearly understand that when we recite. Even I don't understand why I am arguing with someone who didn't even read the Qur'an. If I ever to argue with you about Science, I would have to read the book of Science before I even argue but you haven't even read the Qur'an and just relying on internet research so it is really stupid of me honestly.

Have you ever looked into the sea? If not, then look now:

Spoiler: show

Just look at this picture. It's pretty obvious from this that the sea gets darker and darker by depth. Not at all a miracle.

Once again rushing with reply instead of reading the verse. Read it again, it also talks about internal waves or maybe that is also metaphorical? I cannot do more than giving you the message. I cannot force you to believe something but I can only give you advise to get out of internet research and read.

[Gangsta19]

Pretty sure marrying your cousin is not only morally incorrect but also scientifically inbreeding is frowned upon,but our noble Quran permits it to the Prophet.

"O Prophet, indeed We have made lawful to you your wives to whom you have given their due compensation and those your right hand possesses from what Allah has returned to you [of captives] and the daughters of your paternal uncles and the daughters of your paternal aunts and the daughters of your maternal uncles and the daughters of your maternal aunts who emigrated with you and a believing woman if she gives herself to the Prophet [and] if the Prophet wishes to marry her, [this is] only for you, excluding the [other] believers. We certainly know what We have made obligatory upon them concerning their wives and those their right hands possess, [but this is for you] in order that there will be upon you no discomfort. And ever is Allah Forgiving and Merciful."

https://quran.com/33

How can you say there's science in the Quran when it lacks fundamental human biology knowledge?

[GreaTSaN]

How can you say there's science in the Quran when it lacks fundamental human biology knowledge?

Talk with reference and what human biology says. Now don't say it's a common knowledge just bring your reference and we would talk on this.

[Gangsta19]

How can you say there's science in the Quran when it lacks fundamental human biology knowledge?

Talk with reference and what human biology says. Now don't say it's a common knowledge just bring your reference and we would talk on this.

Are you seriously asking me for 6th grade biology references?
I used to work in a farm and even the farmers (with only elementary education) knew that inbreeding causes defects in livestock ,even plants!


and before you discard this as 'just a wikipedia myth' i suggest you research the 72 reference points it offers.

[GreaTSaN]

How can you say there's science in the Quran when it lacks fundamental human biology knowledge?

Talk with reference and what human biology says. Now don't say it's a common knowledge just bring your reference and we would talk on this.

Are you seriously asking me for 6th grade biology references?
I used to work in a farm and even the farmers (with only elementary education) knew that inbreeding causes defects in livestock ,even plants!


and before you discard this as 'just a wikipedia myth' i suggest you research the 72 reference points it offers.

I know very well what you're talking about but I have to act like I don't know anything so I can understand things better you get it?
Shed some light on this: http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/03/healt ... finds.html

[Gangsta19]

Talk with reference and what human biology says. Now don't say it's a common knowledge just bring your reference and we would talk on this.

Are you seriously asking me for 6th grade biology references?
I used to work in a farm and even the farmers (with only elementary education) knew that inbreeding causes defects in livestock ,even plants!


and before you discard this as 'just a wikipedia myth' i suggest you research the 72 reference points it offers.

I know very well what you're talking about but I have to act like I don't know anything so I can understand things better you get it?
Shed some light on this: http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/03/healt ... finds.html

Right,a New York's Time magazine article discards thousands of scientific studies on genetics.
You can believe whatever you want,constant inbreeding generation by generation can and WILL cause defects and it's backed up by research and data. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2664480/
I've seen it happen to people first hand,cousin marriage will eventually lead to a diseased offspring.But by all means,if you think it's untrue then go ahead and do it.

[GreaTSaN]

Right,a New York's Time magazine article discards thousands of scientific studies on genetics.
You can believe whatever you want,constant inbreeding generation by generation can and WILL cause defects and it's backed up by research and data. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2664480/
I've seen it happen to people first hand,cousin marriage will eventually lead to a diseased offspring.But by all means,if you think it's untrue then go ahead and do it.

You can believe whatever you want.
Bring your scientific proofs and talk with reference don't just use words.

But by all means,if you think it's untrue then go ahead and do it.

I don't have to go ahead and do this. Qur'an doesn't encourage us to do it. It simple allows it. Diseased offspring can still happen with those who are not even related but does that mean it should also be considered wrong? You keep talking about science but you are not bringing some concrete evidences from researchers, or statements from medical scientist. If you bring some article then I can also bring an article discarding all your statements.

Did I say there's no risk in it?
No I didn't say this but if Qur'an allows it doesn't mean it is scientifically wrong. There are many scientists which say there's less to no risk and some even say there's high risk but that doesn't mean we're only going to listen to those who say it is very risky. I've seen many people around marrying their cousin and having good life style and fine offspring and even those who are not related but having some children diseased. Even many medical doctors say that abnormal child can also happen on normal couples not related so does that mean Qur'an allows it so it is scientifically wrong? I hope you don't think like that. Not to mention some of the worst haters of Islam even consider incest to be a "fine" thing. One of them is Lawrence. So does it mean Lawrence is scientifically incorrect person?

[Gangsta19]

Right,a New York's Time magazine article discards thousands of scientific studies on genetics.
You can believe whatever you want,constant inbreeding generation by generation can and WILL cause defects and it's backed up by research and data. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2664480/ ****
I've seen it happen to people first hand,cousin marriage will eventually lead to a diseased offspring.But by all means,if you think it's untrue then go ahead and do it.

You can believe whatever you want.
Bring your scientific proofs and talk with reference don't just use words.
Already did,read the journal.Dont expect me to hand you information on a silver plate.

But by all means,if you think it's untrue then go ahead and do it.

I don't have to go ahead and do this. Qur'an doesn't encourage us to do it. It simple allows it. Diseased offspring can still happen with those who are not even related but does that mean it should also be considered wrong? You keep talking about science but you are not bringing some concrete evidences from researchers, or statements from medical scientist. If you bring some article then I can also bring an article discarding all your statements.READ THE JOURNAL* it's not just an article,it's a peer reviewed scientific document backed by research and data.
While that is true,inbreeding magnifies the effects of diseased offspring,a chance i'm not willing to take (and any rational thinking human shouldnt)

Did I say there's no risk in it?
No I didn't say this but if Qur'an allows it doesn't mean it is scientifically wrong. There are many scientists which say there's less to no risk and some even say there's high risk but that doesn't mean we're only going to listen to those who say it is very risky. I've seen many people around marrying their cousin and having good life style and fine offspring and even those who are not related but having some children diseased. Even many medical doctors say that abnormal child can also happen on normal couples not related so does that mean Qur'an allows it so it is scientifically wrong? I hope you don't think like that. Not to mention some of the worst haters of Islam even consider incest to be a "fine" thing. One of them is Lawrence. So does it mean Lawrence is scientifically incorrect person?

For a book that's supposedly written by God (a perfect being in all aspects) it shouldn't be allowed in the first place,but then again we can sit here and argue all day over and over again,you can choose to believe whatever you want.

[Boone]

It's funny and interesting how tables turn so quickly. I was on Muslims' side one day. But things change. Okay, anyway, let's have this as civilized and respectful as possible hopefully none will get offended.

I would like to reply to every point but I really don't have the time right now, maybe later. Anyways, I will provide you with brief samples yet critical ones that might make you rethink what you believe. Besides, don't listen only to one side (my fault in the past), listen to both sides.

I know Muslims like references, texts and proper distribution of data handed to them, so that's what I'll be doing.

So, please view this video(s) with proper concentration and understanding. It is full of authentic knowledge (review the sources if you aren't convinced);

Sample #1 (Science argument):

Spoiler: show

Sample #2 (General flaws):

Spoiler: show

I'll bring more if you want, I've got plenty of information that I've gathered over the last two years on this topic. I'll gladly share it with whoever needs it.

As for others who address this topic taking an opposite side (counter Islam), if you can, please make sure you have the proper knowledge and evidence(s) to provide to our fellow Muslim friends before replying to them or telling them where or why they're wrong. These topics require strong evidence and great care because they're actually hard to crack, of course, without the proper knowledge. (I'm not necessarily referring to anyone who replied here, I'm just saying this in general)